Screw Apple

[unixronin]

After reading this, there isn't enough money in the world to make me ever want to work at Apple.

Comments

[hugh_mannity]

I've just lost all desire to ever own another Apple product. When my iPod dies it will be replaced by another MP3 player.

[unixronin]

To be fair, echristo says that Diaz is stretching the truth considerably.

[mrmeval.livejournal.com]

I've worked in that environment before. Don't give away secrets and you'll do well. Give away secrets and get fired and/or go to jail. It pays well.

[echristo.livejournal.com]

So, don't leak information...

The rest of the article is total fucking bullshit.

[lblanchard.livejournal.com]

It kind of reminds me of working for the Post Office in the Sixties.

[milktree.livejournal.com]

How is any of that any different than working for any .gov that requires secret or top-secret clearance?

[perspicuity.livejournal.com]

backing of law?

remember: all that apple BS is bullshit. if it's just a job, you tell them to contact your lawyer.

if my employer wants to see what's on my iphone, they can get a court order.

#

[milktree.livejournal.com]

Sure, but that's only if you take your phone to work. They can't raid your house.

If you want to work with Apple's secret not-yet-released shit, you know the deal.

Having said that, I wouldn't work there under those conditions.

[perspicuity.livejournal.com]

well, i assume (esp where i work now), that all my traffic is scrutinized. my work machines are hourly scrubbed for bad things, i'm entirely sure that anything i do i watched carefully in terms of data streams, and my comings and goings are strictly monitored...

but nothing worse than say if i worked at BAE/MITRE - except i'd leave my phone elsewhere... probably locked in a hardbox in my car (since everyone would know it's there)...

of course, i don't think any of those outfits would EVER ask to see my phone or contents.

i've signed extra NDAs to work with IBM secret shit, that was bolted to the concrete floor with special security hardware they supplied, and nobody was allowed into the room that wasn't authorized, and there were visual baffles, and all that stuff. 15+ years ago... apple is nothing new - except that interrogation shit. that wouldn't fly with a good lawyer and employee laws i'd bet.

if they paid well, i'd work there. they wanna see my personal phone/laptop? sorry, no.

#

[unixronin.livejournal.com]

When you're working on national security, that kinda thing is to be expected. But consumer electronic gadgets?

I really think Steve Jobs is losing it.

[polaris93.livejournal.com]

Maybe Jobs' pancreatic cancer metastasized, and some of it went to his brain. As in what happened to John Kramer, a.k.a. Jigsaw, the central character in Saw (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Saw_(film)). (Which could make for a great movie all by itself. It starts with Apple's version of the Gestapo silently closing and locking all the doors to outside of the building while the employees aren't looking. And then . . .) The other thing it reminds me of are Scientology (http://www.xenutv.com)'s version of the secret police -- who, unlike Apple's version, have no qualms at all about subjecting people to handling so rough it has frequently culminated in gross injury to, acute mental illness in, or even the deaths of their victims. Apple isn't that bad -- yet. Steve Jobs isn't L. Ron Hubbard's evil twin. Yet . . .

[lebo-superman.livejournal.com]

I agree that L. Ron Hubbard was a long way from either saintly or perfect, but he's not to blame for what David Miscavige is doing to the members of that church. Hubbard and his "spiritual technology" don't have anything in common with the way things have been for the last 20 years in that organization. Get your target correctly identified.

I was a member of The Church of Scientology, and a staff member for nearly 10 years. I left the church of my own free will. But, it wasn't the policies or the tech that were at fault, it was current management not following them.

[polaris93.livejournal.com]

Yes, well, Scientologists who devoutly believed in L. Ron Hubbard and all his works defrauded my adoptive mother of money she couldn't afford to spend, and left me with a raging case of Graves' Disease that almost killed me, thanks to their incompetent/fraudulent claims of medical expertise. I was just 14 at the time; it was Summer of 1959, my adoptive father had died the previous December, leaving my adoptive mother to try to fend for herself -- and she was very fragile, emotionally speaking, with little experience earning a living and dealing with the world. She was very vulnerable then, and that clinic run by Scientologists took advantage of her -- and me. No, I've got all my targets properly identified. Among other things, I am a practicing Ceremonial Magickian in the so-called Western tradition, a student of Aleister Crowley, who was born at Huntington Hospital, Pasadena, California in 1945 and grew up in San Gabriel and Pasadena, California, and who is not now at all enamored of the creepy subculture of hedge-wizard, half-assed occultists that had come into existence there, of which Hubbard was a member and out of which Scientology was born. Among those of my school -- think of us as practitioners of a Western version of Zen Buddhism -- Hubbard is known as "Frater X," and not with much if any love. He ripped off Jack Parsons, his teacher, claimed to be close friends with Aleister Crowley, Parsons' teacher, when in fact he was anything but, and lied and lied and lied and lied about his career and everything related to it, and frankly, I'd rather be best buddies with a king cobra than have anything to do with Hubbard or Corporate Scientology or Miscavage, for a host of reasons you don't seem to be familiar with.

[lebo-superman.livejournal.com]

I repeat - Hubbard was "a long way from either saintly or perfect". I'm not trying to defend what happened to you or your mother. I agree with you that such actions are worthy of rebuke. I'm also not blind to his other faults. Unlike many who are still in the church, I've used the internet to educate myself as to what those faults may include, and your complaints don't begin to scratch the surface. The only thing I'm trying to accomplish is distancing "scientology" as a philosophy from the current reality of the corporation known as "The Church of Scientology". The two are worlds apart.

But, when you complain about the Church of Scientology's "secret police" you are mostly complaining about something that was called the Guardian's Office when Hubbard was still the Executive Director. The GO wasn't terribly concerned with "internal security" so much as conducting CIA-type information gathering raids on the government, as a response to the fact that the church had been the victim of such raids BY the government. After getting bitch-slapped BY THE GOVERNMENT for this activity, Hubbard closed down the Guardian's Office and most of the members of that area were expelled from the church permanently.

After he assumed control of the church, Miscavige resurrected the GO under a different name, and made church staff and parishioners it's primary targets (though it does work with local governments where legal threats to the local church or other security issues might come up). Still, due to the Department of Special Affairs (DSA) network, if you disagree with DM, the best place to be is permanently outside the church. Which is where I am, and will stay.

Since leaving the Church of Scientology, I've become interested in the occult and Zen Buddhism, though (since I live in SE Kansas) it is rather hard to find teachers to study from. Can you point me to some teachers you trust?

[unixronin.livejournal.com]

I imagine there aren't too many Zen masters in Kansas, yeah...

[polaris93.livejournal.com]

As far as the Guardian's Office goes, I refer you to Xenu TV (http://www.xenutv.com) 's wonderful articles on all aspects of Corporate Scientology past and present. As for the rest, I started studying and practicing the Western Ceremonial tradition and numerous others when I was in my 20s. I'm now 65, and have had four decades of it. Hubbard took the best of what he had to offer from those same traditions; he also threw in a lot of stuff that wasn't that valuable, and some that was downright counterproductive. I figure going straight to the original source, cutting out the middleman, works just as well as anything else. I also grew up not far from where Jack Parsons lived and worked, and over the years I've learned quite a bit about his life and career as well as his relationship with Hubbard, and the relationships they both had with Crowley, who frankly thought that their dabblings in certain risky forms of evocation was idiotic. (He was right, too, as witness the way Parsons died (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jack_Parsons), and what happened to Hubbard as a result of getting busted by the feds for Operation Snow White.) I'd rather stick to what I've found to be trustworthy and of lasting value. Anyway, if you want good teachers, I would recommend the works of Aleister Crowley, especially his Liber (http://www.scribd.com/doc/515813/Liber-777) 777 (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/777_and_Other_Qabalistic_Writings_of_Aleister_Crowley), his Book of Thoth (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Book_of_Thoth_(Crowley)), his Magick Without Tears (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Magick_Without_Tears), his autobiographical Confessions (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Confessions_of_Aleister_Crowley), and just about anything else by him; anything by Israel Regardie, a student of Crowley; Frater Albertus's books on alchemy; and John Lilly's Astrology, if you can find a copy. (Most or even all of these are also available free on the Web -- just goggle title and author to find them.) If you would like more, please let me know.

[lebo-superman.livejournal.com]

Wow! Thank you for the references!

Being new to the studies (only began about 5 years ago) I found out right away that there is a lot of material on the internet, but there is a lot of trash-talking about who has what and how good it's value is for study. Getting recommendations from someone who's been using it for 40 years is a huge help! I'll do the google searches to get those titles tomorrow. Again, thank you!

[polaris93.livejournal.com]

You're most welcome. :-) Anything by Aleister Crowley, Israel Regardie, Frater Albertus, and a few others would be excellent; I gave you titles of their works I have found particularly useful, but there are plenty of others that are good. You should also get a good textbook on geology, and one on physical chemistry and biochemistry, if you don't already have them, so that you can learn the properties of minerals and organic substances, which is very useful when learning alchemy, qaballah, and Magick. Two other types of reference I have found particularly useful, many examples of which I have in my own personal library, are good texts on astrobiology and fire science/scholasticism. I've reviewed a number of these on my blog; click on the following tags to see them: http://polaris93.livejournal.com/tag/astrobiology, http://polaris93.livejournal.com/tag/peter%20d%20ward, http://polaris93.livejournal.com/tag/stephen%20j%20pyne, http://polaris93.livejournal.com/tag/books (and, if you like, follow up with the tags that come up on posts accessed via these links). Along with my literary partner, Rich Ransdell, I have written a number of novels in a science-fiction series called Here There Be Dragons, published versions of some of which can be found at http://www.iuniverse.com/Bookstore/BookSearchResults.aspx?Search=dragon%20drive. One of the central characters of that series is an astrobioligist, a man named Monty Eisenstein, who is also a Ceremonial Magickian. So we've had to do a lot of research on the science as well as the mysteries. :-)

[polaris93.livejournal.com]

Just realized: you might also find these links of use: http://polaris93.livejournal.com/tag/magick, http://polaris93.livejournal.com/tag/qaballah, http://polaris93.livejournal.com/tag/alchemy, http://polaris93.livejournal.com/tag/astrology, http://polaris93.livejournal.com/tag/dragons, http://polaris93.livejournal.com/tag/vesta, http://polaris93.livejournal.com/tag/poetry. Some of the posts accessed via these links include material on various esoteric subjects.

[polaris93.livejournal.com]

And last, but not least, is http://polaris93.livejournal.com/tag/fire -- fire has been with us for at least two million years, it seems now. We are unique in our ability to make and deploy fire and secondary sources of high heat. Neurologically and spiritually, our relationship with fire is deep in the human makeup. The science, mythology, mystique, and historical use of fire by human beings is therefore intimately intertwined with Magick as we use it: Magick is the Art and Science of causing change in conformity with Will, and anthropogenic fire is one way we have wrought enormous changes in the natural and human world.

[lebo-superman.livejournal.com]

Hmmmm . . . after spending over an hour clicking on links from my google search, I can't seem to find a copy of the "Book of Thoth" that isn't either "membership required" or on a torrent. I got Liber 777. Now I'm going to start looking for "Magick without Tears" and "Confessions".

I'll take a look in my archives - I think I already have some of Frater Albertus's books. He was referenced in an online alchemy study group I joined briefly (internal bickering soured me on the group).

[polaris93.livejournal.com]

The Book of Thoth -- both the book and the Tarot pack -- are widely available, including on amazon.com. I'd try there -- often you can get real bargains on such things.

[rain-manpnw.livejournal.com]

So, "Fair Game" is not Hubbard tech?

[lebo-superman.livejournal.com]

As it was originally written, it was meant to apply to corporations/governments/people who were ACTIVELY trying to do serious harm to the Church. In that sense, yes it was Hubbard's policy.

However, DM has since broadened it's use to include anyone who disagrees with DM, or mentions in a SecCheck that they've thought about leaving staff, or dares to ask why DM never gives concrete numbers when he's announcing "highest ever" stats at the events. In that sense, no, it's not Hubbard's policy.

Hubbard wrote policy that specifically stated that ANYONE who requested a refund was to be payed that refund in full before the next weekly staff meeting. HA! I've seen people spend years getting their "donations" back, if they even managed to get them then! I've seen the best and most successful staff in an org tossed out and "declared" for no better reason than a rich relative wouldn't come in until that person was gone. LRH at least tried to service people - DM only services bank accounts.

[polaris93.livejournal.com]

I have heard that while Hubbard was actively in charge of the Church of Scientology, it was much more light-hearted than now, and even fun. Hubbard is said to have taught that Scientology and Dianetics should be fun. That is not the case with Corporate Scientology as it now is. David Miscavage is obviously one of those opportunistic little bastards who, given the opportunity to have total power over a group of helpless people, enjoys wielding to the fullest -- in the manner of, say, an Ivan the Terrible. That only happened after Hubbard's death, so it can't be blamed on Hubbard. Miscavage is now on the run because Interpol, the FBI, etc. want him on human trafficking charges. I just hope that without him Scientology will become something which can be fun once again, because it sure as hell ain't now!

[randwolf.livejournal.com]

Considering that my cell phone has 4GB of flash memory and a USB interface, yes, consumer electronic gadgets. This is awful and invasive, I do see the logic.

[echristo.livejournal.com]

Well, as obviously the only apple employee responding to this - it's crap. They don't do that stuff.

Oh, and obviously we all have cameras - they gave us all iphones.

Fucking gizmodo.

[unixronin.livejournal.com]

So Diaz is being, uh ... inventive with the details?

[echristo.livejournal.com]

Yeah.

[otherbill.livejournal.com]

I've known quite a few Apple employees as well, and none of them have ever described anything remotely close to this.

(Admittedly, this evidence is only anecdotal, but it's still data.)

[ehintz.livejournal.com]

Put one more ex-Appelian into that anecdotal bin...

Now, admittedly, I was there just as Steve was coming back ('96-'99), and I was working in an environment that was relatively shielded from product development, and I was at Austin TX and Sacramento CA, not 1 Infinite. But, I never saw or heard of this sort of behavior. And I was privy to pre-release info on products (I was responsible for supporting the damn things after all).

A lot could have changed since my days, but it does kinda have the smell of over hyped BS to me.

That said, I did my time at the fruit co. I tend to never say never (it is a long time, after all), but it will be a surprising day indeed if I ever get another paystub from them. Not in the least because they have no presence whatsoever in NZ...

[lebo-superman.livejournal.com]

This is all, very literally, Microsoft's fault. Specifically, the fault of Bill Gates.

I can remember back in the old "DOS" days, when word first started to trickle around that "someone" had software that would open multiple windows for multitasking. It seemed like only about 15-20% of the techies I knew were even interested in it.

But, it would seem that Bill Gates could see the potential, and how to monopolize on it. He sent spies to Apple, stole the Windows software, and then beat Apple to market with it. The coup-de-gras was that when Apple tried to bring their version (essentially the same thing, since Bill stole it from them) to market, Bill sued for infringement & won. Then he started working on the contracts that got Windows embedded on nearly all new computer systems sold direct-to-consumer, and Microsoft became the biggest company in the world.

Steve Jobs has a lot of reason to act the way he does. He's already been burned, severely.

[unixronin.livejournal.com]

Well, that's not really quite how it happened. Apple and Microsoft each accused the other of stealing the idea of graphical windowing interfaces from the other, but the truth is BOTH of them stole the idea from Xerox PARC.

That said, Windows 1.x and the Mac OS 1.x were really not all that similar at all beyond the conceptual level. Totally different architectural approaches implementing very different GUI metaphors.

As for Steve Jobs, ... well, there's this joke about the Steve Jobs Reality Distortion Field. Now, obviously I don't see the man every day. But from what I've seen, it seems like over the past 10 years or so his visible decisions have been becoming ... I won't say erratic, but there's something that bothers me.

[randwolf.livejournal.com]

He seems to be more secretive. He's been through major surgery, and that often changes personality. On the other hand, his marketing decisions are still dead on. There is no other company that could do what Apple has done with the iPhone and iPad. Maybe Google would have got Round Tuit eventually, but they're the only firm I can think of.

Something really wrong with our creativity, I think.

[rain-manpnw.livejournal.com]

I've often said ...

Bill Gates is shit on tech, but he's a brilliant marketer and business strategist.

Steve Wozniak is a brilliant engineer and technician, but what he knows about running a business could fit on a 70's-era 256 BIT dynamic RAM chip - unpowered.

Steve Jobs _thinks_ he's the next Bill Gates, but he sucks at both tech and marketing. He does, however, have people skills to hook up with and manipulate those who do have tech and business savvy/.

I often wonder where we'd be if Gates and Woz had hooked up ...

[unixronin.livejournal.com]

That could have been pretty interesting, yeah.

[randwolf.livejournal.com]

Most big corps these days are capable of awful abuses. Intel has aggressive security--I've never see them do lockdown & search, but I'm sure they're capable of it. IBM, also.

The anarchist utopia can't arrive too soon. :-)

[otherbill.livejournal.com]

Intel's security isn't anywhere close to what's described in this article. In fact, the "physical security" measures are far more lax now than they were in the dot-com era.

[randwolf.livejournal.com]

When I was a contractor there--twice, two different times separated by over a decade, in two different roles--their routine security involved metal detectors and briefcase searches. In case of industrial accident, we were told to call their emergency personnel, not 911. Keep in mind I was not a senior engineer--I was a grunt. I think they are perfectly capable of a lock-down search of personal property, just as Apple is reported to do.

[cymrullewes.livejournal.com]

Metal detectors when you walk in, maybe. But it seems more like they're detecting if you've got the Intel ID card. Also, EHS at Intel is RIGHT THERE, some are EMTs, and there's an RN on site.

[unixronin.livejournal.com]

I really don't have a problem at all with them having their own emergency-response right on site. After all, as the saying goes, "When seconds count, the police are only minutes away." And that applies just as much to other emergency services too.

[randwolf.livejournal.com]

It was possibly the most secure environment I've worked in. No. Not "possibly." The most secure, period. The only place that searched briefcases. Yes, EHS is right there, and that's a good reason to call them, but it does strike me that they also want to control how the information about accidents gets out. Intel was an unpleasant place to work, but they do have a good safety record...or do they? Would we know?

[house-pundit.livejournal.com]

This sounds like it would be awfully expensive to implement.

If I was running a company like Apple, I'd take lessons from other organizations--like nation states--on security. Obviously, you can't shoot "traitors." LOL Well, okay, you can't get caught.

Anyway. Put in degrees of security classification of information, compartmentalize information based on need to know, have a clearance process in terms of checking your credit, criminal history, etc. and clearing at various levels.

But you have to balance procedures against the bottom line, just like a nation state does. Just like your body's immune system does.

Organizations function like organisms. They have analogous evolutionary pressures and whether they live or die is compounded of natural selection and a bit of luck.

I doubt the story is true, but if it was it would be the analog of anaphylaxis. Organizations that go into anaphylaxis end up like humans who do the same thing. It just takes longer.