The return of BLAM!

[unixronin]

No, I'm not talking about Schlock Mercenary.  olafthunderfoot found this report, which asserts that the US Department of Defense has finally ditched the Beretta M9 (after 20 years of reliability issues and unsatisfactory performance in the field), and is going back to a .45 pistol.  SOCOM has been tasked with finding the M9's replacement, to be designated the Joint Combat Pistol.

I think I know a lot of grunts who are going to be very happy with this decision.

(For Schlock fans, here's some classic BLAM from the archives.)

Comments

[ilcylic.livejournal.com]

Goddamn it. 10 millimeter!

-Ogre

[olafthunderfoot.livejournal.com]

but 11.4mm is bigger!

[ilcylic.livejournal.com]

Yeah, but 200 gr slugs @ 1275 fps!

I just like 10mm and wanted to see military surplus ammo.

-Ogre

[olafthunderfoot.livejournal.com]

lol!

[unixronin.livejournal.com]

In 10mm, I'd prefer 180gr at 1400. I'm a big believer in flat trajectory and short time of flight.

[ilcylic.livejournal.com]

I'm with you, which is why mine is loaded with 135gr JHP @ 1600. I was just trying to come up with the round most comparable with std 230 gr Military Ball ammo.

-Ogre

[technoshaman.livejournal.com]

Whoa. That's *extremely* hot. Glock rates their weapon (Model 20) to deliver 180gr at 1200fps.

Now, 155gr at 1400 I could believe; Georgia Arms rates theirs at 1375, and they tend to be just a half-notch off CorBon for speed and a half-notch up for accuracy, at least in my experience.

I tend towards the bigger round in colder climes, but that's just me... that and I'm not trying to nail anything at more than 15 yards or so, so trajectory and time of flight... meh. If I was, I would run the curves for velocity vs. weight vs. range and see which one gave me most energy on target...

[ilcylic.livejournal.com]

Doubletap sells 180s that do 1300 out of a Glock. It's within SAAMI spec.

Barrel length helps, too.

-Ogre

[unixronin.livejournal.com]

I don't actually load 10mm, since I don't own one, so I don't actually know what would be safely attainable. I guess my point was that I'd consider the sweet spot for 10mm to probably lie somewhere in the 155gr-180gr range. I load 155gr in my .40S&W.

[unixronin.livejournal.com]

"It also makes a bigger hole." -- Sam McCloud

[olafthunderfoot.livejournal.com]

~grinz~

[technoshaman.livejournal.com]

OOH-RAH!

I know just the thing. The Glock 21. Assuming, of course, that it's as good as the late-model 17's are. While I have a problem personally with striker-fired weapons, there are a few things that a Glock will do that most other weapons won't... like, feed wadcutters, or (with special LEO-equipment) fire underwater. And the smaller combat tupperware is already field-tested.

Of course, I imagine a helluva lot of people are going to do what a goodly number have already done - go get a 1911 like G-d John Moses Browning intended in the first place... although the mods I would make on one for use as a soldier's sidearm are a lot different from those carrying as, well, anyone else... looser tolerances in certain places, for one. I don't want just one little grit of sand to jam the weapon. (Kalashnikov-engineered weapons are famous for working in the desert where these damn tinker-toy weapons they give our side screw up.)

[olafthunderfoot.livejournal.com]

~shudders~ glocks are too flippy!

[technoshaman.livejournal.com]

Flippy? as in too much recoil?

If that's your thought, I dunno. I remember being out in the New Mexico desert once, I had a 1911, and my friend had a G21. We were playing kick-the-can, and swapped weapons. I did better *the first time* with his weapon than I had with my own, which I had been practicing with for a year.

The '21 is a fair bit heavier than the '17, even relatively speaking. Personally, I do like the way the 1911 fills my hand, and I'm not a big fan of striker-fired weapons, either. But still. Soldiers do a lot of things to weapons us civillians would never do. Different application, different weapon.

[olafthunderfoot.livejournal.com]

yup, the ones i rented had more felt recoil then my redhawk in .44 magnum!

[technoshaman.livejournal.com]

What the heck were you shooting in that thing, some of unixronin's handloads? :)

As I said, dif'rent strokes.... a fellow I once knew was partial to a little .380 mouse gun known as a "Grendel"... it was only 15oz empty, and while his Chewbacca-sized paws could hang on to the thing, I couldn't; it would strain the web of my hand. Much prefer something about twice that weight...

[olafthunderfoot.livejournal.com]

don't ask me, the range sold me the ammo. problem is the damned gun's too friggin light!

[unixronin.livejournal.com]

Well, actually, the problem -- which is the same problem in most polymer-framed pistols, IME -- is not that the gun is light per se, but that so much of its weight is concentrated in the recoiling slide. This tends to produce very exaggerated muzzle jump for the actual recoil impulse. I recall shooting a Glock 15 or 17 once (the short-slide 9mm, whichever that is), using generlc probably-subsonic 147gr white-box reloads, and it had substantially more felt recoil -- due solely to the muzzle flip -- than my Para-Ordnance loaded with 200gr +P.

[radarrider.livejournal.com]

That would be either the Glock 19 (compact) or Glock 26 (subcompact). I have one of each. The 26 grip is short enough that your pinky is off the bottom. It definitely benefits from a magazine with the optional pinky rest. (Side note: the Glock 17 is the first production model so there was no 15.)

[unixronin.livejournal.com]

Not being of the Glockisti, I stand corrected. :) It was probably either a 17 or 19; it was definitely not a 26.

[olafthunderfoot.livejournal.com]

that's a great theory, but i didn't notice that problem when shooting an H&K USP-45

[unixronin.livejournal.com]

I did. I also noticed that I could feel the trigger flex on every shot.

[radarrider.livejournal.com]

There is also the Glock 37 in the new 45GAP (http://mywebpages.comcast.net/petej/compare.45acp.45gap.htm) (Glock Auto Pistol). Some may question why we need another .45 chambering but, since the cartridge is shorter, you can have a smaller grip, the same size as the G17, which is one of the principal complaints about the G21. The cartridge is also stronger and, with today's powders, can put out the same power as the .45ACP, especially since the .45ACP cartridge usually has some empty space in it due to improved powder.

[appin.livejournal.com]

Nice choice in music!